Collaboration Versus Competition: What Serves The Wedding Industry Better?

 

When growing your business, the traditional approach to dealing with competitors is by beating them. However, in this episode, hosts Jamie Wolfer and Heather Loree Fier veer away from this thinking and instead reflect on the immense value collaboration has brought to their businesses and their clients. Not only true to them, but this idea has also been slowly starting to set the wedding industry on fire. They dive deeper to discuss why this traditional approach no longer serves wedding vendors or clients and how a shift from a scarcity to an abundance mindset benefits your business even more. Giving you a fuller perspective, Jamie and Heather also tap on the logistics of collaborating with a competitor. Get inside in today’s discussion and find immense value from this unconventional business approach.

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Listen to the podcast here:

Important Links:

• Claire Marie Coordination
• Court & Company Weddings
• YouTube – Jamie’s YouTube Channel
• www.TheUnionPodcast.com/events

Collaboration Versus Competition: What Serves The Wedding Industry Better?

Jamie: We are going to be talking about why you should choose collaboration over competition. This is an idea that is slowly starting to set the wedding world on fire and we want to take a deep dive into it in this episode. We want to talk about the traditional approach and why it no longer serves vendors or clients and how collaboration and a shift from a scarcity to an abundance mindset can set your business on fire. How to collaborate with a competitor because let’s be honest, it’s confusing sometimes and grow your businesses together and how Heather and I personally have used this technique and how it has served us.

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Heather: Let’s talk about this traditional approach here, Jamie, and why we don’t think it’s totally working anymore, “Competition, let’s beat the other guy down,” doesn’t work. For me, I see it as something where if you’re leading with that negative, if you’re leading with the fear, all of that is going to work for short-term gains, but it’s not going to grow your business and your brand in the way that you’re wanting. I see collaboration, building those bridges, bringing people together, building a community as far more valuable. We were discussing that in the wedding space, we see some of the vendors have already realized this and it is crushing for them. The photographers love it. They have amazing communities. They meet up and support each other. They refer work openly between each other and it opens opportunities. It opens doors but for some reason, in other verticals within the wedding industry, there’s none of this. People are showing their competitors no love. They are not wanting to be supportive or open and it’s hurting everybody. What do you think?

Jamie: I look at these photographers going on these retreats in Palm Springs and I’m like, “I want a retreat in Palm Springs. I want to sit on a flamingo floaty and talk about the woes of wedding planning.” I want to talk to somebody else who gets it. There’s something about being able to talk to another wedding planner that I’m like, “You understand this struggle or this pain point or how I’m struggling to grow this area,” and yet I have very few people that I can turn to for that. I think of photographers in their Palm Springs retreats and I remember being like, “Can you just relate to me? Thank you.” Maybe it’s wedding planners and maybe it’s because we’re in the wedding planner bubble. We’re not seeing the other vendors are doing this but I’m super jealous about those cute photography retreats.

Heather: It does look so fun and then they get so many cute photos because they’re all such capable photographers where it’s like, “I could add 0% to that for sure. My photography skills are not going to win any awards.” I think a lot of it is this fear that people have and it is not helping them and it is not cute. I know with the business that I’m building, I am all about collaboration. I try to invite other wedding planners to be involved and they can do features on my site and all sorts of stuff. I have talked to many of them with the idea of even building out like a network and referring folks because I get clients from all over the world.

I can’t be at their weddings and when I contact regional wedding planners, let’s say in North Carolina and I’m like, “I’ve got leads I can potentially send you.” I have a wedding planner tell me, “No. You’re a competitor. Click.” I’m like, “Excuse me. I’m in California. I’m trying to give you work. I am trying to make a win-win.” The fear is so strong and thick that they’re not even willing to listen to me explain what I got going on. That’s my experience of it. As far as other verticals, especially being a planner, they see you as this cog in the whole system and that anyone else who’s not a wedding planner is open to talking to a wedding planner. Wedding planner to wedding planners, there is a little problem there.

Jamie: I don’t know what that is and sometimes, I still feel it. I totally still buy into that, “You’re my competition,” and I have to work my mind away from that because it’s not true. I’m a firm believer and this is something if anyone has ever had like a meet and greet phone call with me, where they’re considering hiring us, hiring my team to plan their wedding or run their wedding day. One of the last things that I say in the ending part of the phone call is, “Talk to other planners. Do it. Please talk to other planners because your photographer, your videographer and your wedding planner are the three vendors that are the most lovingly in your face on your wedding day.” I guarantee you, if anyone’s ever had that call with me, they’re like, “Jamie, sounds like a broken record,” but the personality matters. You have to like a person.

It’s been a journey for me to figure out that I’m not everybody’s cup of tea. “Rude? What? I know,” but that someone else could better suit them and their budget. Maybe they like the sound of that person’s voice better. Maybe they enjoy their package better if it offers an extra meeting more than I do or things like that. It has been a brain shift for me and I still have moments where I jumped back into the, “I don’t want to send them business,” but I don’t want all the business. I want to find someone who wants to hang out with me. Making that mind shift away is super important.

Heather: I think it serves the couples so much better if the vendors can step back from that super competitive nature and open the door to collaboration and sharing leads and referring folks. Also, being able to refer leads to other price points. That’s one area that people get stuck on and it’s a trap because so many vendors do not put their pricing on their website and I understand. Some of you don’t want to do that. You feel like they’re going to see that price and they’re never going to call you. That’s okay. This is your prerogative. You do what you want to do, but I was going to say, “Save yourself some time.”

If you're leading with fear, all you’re working is for short-term gains. It's not going to grow your business and brand the way you want. Click To Tweet

That would be my opinion because if someone’s looking at your website and they know that is $2,000 more than I would ever pay, why do you want to spend time talking to them? You don’t. Taking that step to avoid wasting their time and your time and then if you do end up on a call with someone who’s like, “This isn’t going to work. I can’t afford this,” but they love what you do. Having a few other folks in your vertical that you can refer to at a lower price point is very smart and potentially you can even set up a deal with that other vendor that you get a referral kickback and make it a good thing. Make it a win for yourself.

Jamie: To touch on the pricing on the website thing, I was in camp no price on the website for a long time. I was and it wasn’t until the YouTube channel took off and someone in Kansas contacted me with an $8,000 or $10,000 budget wanting to hire us and I was like, “Time after time, I kept telling these people.” How do I politely say, “Please don’t spend money on me?” I can’t justify if we take up a fourth of your wedding budget just to travel there. Touching on the pricing on the website thing, I did switch over and I now have my pricing listed on my website. My inquiries have plummeted because of that and part of that’s okay. I’m okay with that because again, I don’t need all business but you do have to pick what works best for you because if I could get somebody on the phone, if I had no pricing on my website, my booking rate percentage was excellent. We do have to pick what works best for you and do you time for those calls? Just like a pause, little aside, we should probably make whole episodes about these.

Heather: Your conversion is better with the pricing.

Jamie: No, my conversion was better without it.

Heather: You’re a top-notch salesperson.

Jamie: If I could get them on the phone, they book me and that boomerang effect of sending them out to look at other planners, actually ended up being really fruitful for me because I’m encouraging them. I don’t sound desperate and I’m telling them that what they want and what they need is the most important priority here and not me getting clients. I can give recommendations like Claire Marie Coordination or Court & Company Weddings. These are other planners that I’ve worked with that I think you’re going to enjoy whose price points are different. Feel free to check them out.

I have found that has been extremely beneficial to make that statement and be like, “Go ahead. Go fly away,” and so many of them do come back and it’s very affirming, but it is about making that shift of like, “No, I’m going to choose to actively recognize that.” With that in mind, it is how collaboration and a shift from that scarcity mindset that like, “What if I don’t get clients? What if it’s not going to happen?” to then realizing that there’s an abundance of people getting married out there and you’re not going to run out of clients and how that can set your business on fire. I’m going to allow Heather to jump in on this. What are your thoughts on that, Heather?

Heather: I think it was poetic beauty how you basically said you set them free like a beautiful bluebird and they fly back to you because they love you, they connected to you and they see how pure-hearted you are. You want them to have the most amazing wedding of all time. As a vendor doing that approach, it’s going to impress people and I am astounded with the success you had there with no price listed upfront, that you were able to convert a huge amount of people. That shows and validates how much having that abundance mindset, not seeming desperate, not seeming afraid and knowing that you are a great option and being confident in it because that confidence sells people too. They see that and they’re like, “This lady knows what she’s doing. I want to work with someone who is so confident that they are telling me to check around and you won’t find anything that you probably like better than me.”

 

You don’t have to say that part, but it’s implied and that’s part of what’s going on there. I think also looking at your business as an opportunity to bring many different revenue sources. Referring to someone at a lower price point where you’re getting a commission perhaps or referring even to Jamie’s course or my club or something like that. There are opportunities with those things where you could get the affiliate commission, something like that, that opens up a total stream of revenue that was not there for you before or building something yourself that’s in that mindset. There are many different ways to look at it as abundance, not that there are plenty of opportunities, but there are opportunities to very easily serve different populations that you’ve been overlooking and not paying attention to and come up with new revenue flow for yourself.

Jamie: It’s that mind shift and sitting in that mind shift for a minute and realizing there’s a ton of business out there. You’re going to get it. If the business is slow this year, it’s slow this year, but don’t worry, next year is 2020 and it’s going to be like madness for us in the wedding industry because everyone wants that anniversary date. To tone that back and dial it down, I realized, “I don’t need all this business.” That’s one of the biggest things I learned early on because I was so desperate to get clients. I take everything and say yes to everything and it was exhausting. I’m going to be honest, it made me bitter. It made me angry and resentful. I’ve got kids at home and I can’t be this Bitter Betty running around all the time.

Taking that mindset of, “I’m going to set him free. I’m going to find other planners, photographers, florists who have the same vibe, the same idea and I’m going to send them their direction. If they come back to me, okay.” Removing that desperation and settling on that piece, “I have other options. I have people I can collaborate with. I can make some money off an affiliate link and I don’t have to take all the clients.” It’s so relieving to make that shift and ironically, you get more business. You end up making more money. It ends up being an incredible shift. Both of us are living proof of that.

Heather: Definitely in this business and in my prior business, we were all about collaboration. The company I had before that grew to a national scale, we went and we sought out the competition and made agreements to work with them and to send leads to them. We found that our business could grow and grow by developing a team and scaling in that direction versus us trying to spin our wheels 24 hours a day to keep up with workflow in more of a vertical fashion. We went horizontally and we freaked out the competition, to be honest.

When we talked to them, they’d be like, “We do the same thing. Why are you calling me?” “I’m trying to ask if we can work together.” They are like, “No.” Because we’re going to have so much business, we’re going to kill it. We’re going to blow up this year that I need places to send the work I cannot handle. Having that perspective and putting yourself out there, like for example, Jamie’s YouTube channel, the amount of visibility she’s getting, the workflow coming to her is not possible for one woman, let alone business or team. There needs to be pressure release valves and having these collaborative connections can allow you to do that and have the confidence in yourself that you’re going to have that abundant business.

Jamie: It’s shaking off that desperation and it’s nice to have someone to commiserate with too even if you’re not sending them business. It’s nice to talk to somebody else and be like, “I am struggling with this budget or I have this vendor that I’m dealing with that’s not responding to emails and I’m frustrated.” Being able to vent or being like, “I don’t know how I’m going to live life after these client’s wedding is over because I’m going to miss them so desperately.” A group to talk to that understands what you do is so powerful.

Heather: I will say one of the most powerful things to collaborate with competitors and grow your business together is something in the mastermind model. My husband has his business. He works in marketing and he has so many marketing friends, it’s insane. At first, it seemed a little strange to me because I’m like, “You’re basically talking to all these other people who do the same thing as you. You’re all competing against each other but you’re going to sit around and talk about the different tricks and tips you’re using to get the best clients. How’s that happening?” He’s like, “No. This is great. We’re all building each other up. We’re all making each other better and raising the bar.” Ultimately, there are so many opportunities out there. You don’t have time in the day to take care of all of them.

Masterminds, bringing together other people who are in the same industry as you, who can help, give you new perspective, ideas and feedback on what you’re doing. Sometimes when you’re right there in the forest, you can see the trees. When you’re right in the middle of your business though, you don’t even notice the stuff that you’re missing. It’s flying right by you. Where if you take a step back and you talk to other people who are not in the industry there, they’re going to point it out to you. You can work together to ultimately have success for everyone and there are so many win-win opportunities. Any good business person out there is going to be looking for those. What do you think about how different folks might be able to collaborate with their competitors, Jamie?

Any good business person out there is going to be looking for win-win opportunities. Click To Tweet

Jamie: How can they do that effective process? One is accept that you’re going to collaborate without bitterness, without frustration and without any holdbacks and be like, “I’m going to do it. I’m going to dive in. I’m going to find someone else who gets this. I’m going to find another resource to lean on.” The mentality of it steps one where you’ve got to get yourself to space where you’re like, “I’m reaching out. This may be weird. I may not be well-received like you have with other planners, but get ready to do it. It’s going to feel weird. It might feel different but it’s going to be beneficial.”

One thing that I do is when I have interns, assistants or other lead planners, I’m going to be honest, every single one of them has their wedding planning business except for one. One of them does not, but she’s a professional personal assistant. She’s so good at her industry, but every single one has their own company. They work weddings for me when they can, when they want to, when they have room in their schedules. They assist me when they can, when they want to, when they room their schedules but I typically don’t grow up brand new interns simply because I don’t have the time. I haven’t honed in my teaching process yet. That’s a very tangible way that I do this.

I don’t have to train them. It’s like adopting a dog instead of getting a puppy. Puppies are tough and sweet and they’ve got little puppy toes. They are so wonderful but sometimes you don’t have time in life for that. That may sound a little bit patronizing. That’s not at all how we intend it, but I specifically choose. When I’m talking to people who might be interns or potential interns, I always ask, “What do you want to do? Where do you want to go with this? Do you want to grow up a business?” I always immediately followed it up with, “It’s okay if you say yes. That’s actually one of my favorite things to do is get with someone who’s starting their company because then I can save you from making those mistakes.”

That’s something that I do purposely to choose collaboration as well as if I’m booked, I will refer them to somebody else. I go, “Check out this person,” and oftentimes they’ve been my assistants or they’ve been leads for weddings for me and I know their work. I choose to take collaboration with an actual day. I go that far of, “Let’s get another planner who has their company to come and watch me.” At first, I was like, “What if they steal my ideas?” Then I realize that we’re both learning from each other. That has been basically how I’ve chosen to take people who could be competitors and work with them.

Heather: You’re bringing them right into the fold, into the heart of your business.

Jamie: I’m giving them all the secrets. I keep referring to Claire as she’s been probably the first other planners that I was like, “Get in here. Let’s do this. I’ll tell you everything.” I shared my contracts with her. I was like, “You need to draw boundaries here and here. Why?” Because I didn’t, so do that and how it’s fostered a relationship with someone who has her own wedding planning business that I can now turn to and I can send business to and all those things.

Heather: It’s super important and I love how you’ve handled that. That makes total sense to me. I have done the route of having interns and that can be very difficult. It’s not to say that I wouldn’t do it again and there are certainly people who have been interns who moved their way up with me where they’re paid and you know they’re doing their business and everything’s great, but it is a lot more work upfront. There’s a pro and con in there. A way I’ve worked to collaborate with competitors is actually holding local networking events. This is a major secret that’s not a secret at all. The person who brings the community together is inherently seen as an expert, a leader and someone who is a person to be respected.

You take the initiative to set up a little networking event in Omaha, wherever you’re from, you’re going to bring together the people in this community. Contact other planners, get them to spread the word, but you are the one who steps up in front of everyone and goes, “Thank you for coming. Thank you for being at my event.” By you taking that initiative, you have now positioned yourself as someone of authority and that helps open so many doors where your name is now known, you’ve now grown your network, you get all these people’s contact info that you can now follow up with and develop plans of how you can potentially help compound this effort. It’s a simple thing.

 

If you looked at that and you went, “I’m not going. I’m a photographer and I’m not going to invite other photographers to this event because I want to be the only photographer.” You’re not going to get very far because those other folks already have photographers they like. If they’re friends to a photographer who is going to your party, they might invite more friends. It’s going to ripple out. You need to have the confidence that you can invite these people and it will all work out and you will be in this position of authority. That’s one thing that I’ve used several times is holding events of different types, big, small, it doesn’t matter. Especially if you’re a wedding planner, you know how to throw an event. Throw out some party.

One time, I went to a restaurant in the area that I lived in at the time and I told them, “You have a bomb diggity space here. I see you don’t really do anything for events. Can we do an event launch party here?” I will bring together the wedding community. I will bring together this event community. You give me space, free drinks, free food for the night.” They were like, “Yes. We want the event industry people to know about our space.” I threw together a little shindig and it was awesome. I brought together probably about 150 vendors and got to connect with everybody. There are ways with very little costs that can help you open doors for collaboration and also position you in a place where people are going to want to collaborate with you. That one is not so much how you can collaborate except the fact that you invite the people in your same vertical because they’ve got friends. You’ve got friends, they’ve got referrals and you’ve got referrals. Everybody can cohesively work together and make it a good thing for everybody.

Jamie: One thing we haven’t touched on at all is emergency situations. As we’re sitting here talking about this, I’m like, “If something went down.” My mom has actually been one of my assistants and lead planners because she has been my biggest advocate. She’s basically my right-hand lady. She had a situation where she got injured and she couldn’t run the event and I had double booked that day. I was in a mad scramble to find somebody. I didn’t know what to do, I’m like, “Who do I call? She hurt her knee. She can’t walk. I’m booked elsewhere. I can’t be there.” If I had chosen to not jump into the community, I would have been in a pretty big pickle and I was because I only had one other planning company to reach out to. Even then, it was like, “Can I borrow one of your leads, please? Thank you.”

I didn’t have an option. My business was still small and we’re still growing but had I had a network of people that I could go on and put up a Facebook blast out and be like, “Help me,” or a specific other planners that I could call or three planners that I knew at the drop of a hat, I could call and be like, “Help me out. Who do you suggest? What are some resources? Let’s go.” It would have changed so much. Collaboration can help in those moments too because if we continued to have a competitive spirit about this kind of stuff, what’s going to happen? We all have acts of God clauses in our contracts. We all do because it happens. Are you ready for that? Do you have a community in place for you to jump in if something does go down?

Heather: I would also like to point out that something like this show, technically Jamie and I are folks that have the same business. We offer online coaching and training and stuff for couples. Together we’re able to help a lot more people, open our network further and spitball some ideas here that you all might like in your ear holes. Ultimately, it’s for your joy and ours that we get to team up here on something so special is this show.

Jamie: To touch on that specifically, we both have online courses, for couples, for wedding planning, but they’re structured completely differently. Mine is a collective ten modules. It’s a one-time purchase. You either do it for 6 months or for 12 months and that’s it. This is something that Heather and I talked about before I even launched the course. There is no handholding along the way except for the videos, the show notes and the documents. I believe enough in them that they standalone and also I can’t sacrifice more of my time for one-on-one consultations, phone calls or doing deep dives with people consistently. That is something that Heather’s course excels at. There is a monthly option and you have monthly phone calls with these couples, correct?

Heather: Yes, we have monthly calls. They’re group calls and we get everybody on the line. They can shoot in their personal issues every month and we will talk about all of them. You’re getting a course to guide you, but when you have the drama, go down with that Aunt Suzie or maybe it’s Aunt Sally, then you are going to be able to talk to someone who can walk you away from the ledge and calm you down, give you some guidance of how to deal with it. How to handle a weird contract some vendor sent you that is a newbie and it didn’t make any sense and those things. I’m right there in the nitty-gritty with you.

We even offer upgraded options where you can have even monthly calls and stuff. We try to make it a little more of a hybrid full-service planning versus a straight-up course. It’s going to suit different people and a lot of what we talk about are super tactical of being a wedding hacker as in coming up with those alternatives to save at every turn. That’s a little tricky and some folks don’t want to learn about that or do that. They’re like, “I just want to hire vendors. Why are you telling me about foraging in your yard?” and that’s okay.

The person who brings the community together is inherently seen as an expert, a leader, and someone who is to be respected. Click To Tweet

Jamie: There’s nothing wrong with either one of our courses. They’re both online wedding planning courses and they’re different. They are not meant for everybody. Someone who wants the monthly phone calls is going to go with Heather’s course and that’s okay. I don’t want people jumping into my course being like, “This didn’t meet my expectations.” That’s fine. Go to Heather’s. She’s got a great course. I simply chose not to do monthly phone calls because YouTube takes a long time. It is a big job. I chose a different route personally, but because I now know that she exists and this course of hers exists, if someone’s looking for something more hands-on, “Go to Heather’s.” I’d rather have a satisfied client purchasing Heather’s course than a disgruntled one asking for a refund on mine.

Heather: It’s the same thing here. I’d rather them go over and work with you if they’re wanting that Jamie energy, I can’t quite pump up the volume of my energy to Jamie’s level. It’s what it is but that’s okay. I love Jamie’s energy. I’m trying to bring it and I get 80% of the way there. Everybody’s got different things that are going to work for them and ultimately, that’s an example of how we are in real life right now, straight up. As we’re doing this, working with a competitor and that is totally okay and a beautiful thing.

Jamie: One of my mentors early on in the business said, “There’s a butt for every seat,” and if I don’t say that in every single episode of this show, I’m doing something wrong. There is a client for every wedding planner, there is a couple for every photographer. If you pass on a couple and they’re not the couple you want anyways. If they drive you nuts or your personalities don’t gel, they should go to somebody else. This idea of collaboration gives you an option of you would rather have a happy client with someone else than an unhappy client with you.

Heather: Deep down you know when you’re talking to someone and you’re like, “This is going to be one of those torturous clients and I should not sign myself up for this.” If you’re getting that feeling, it is okay for you to step away and know that’s not right and send them off searching for some other person that maybe can deal with that situation. That’s part of it too. Keep your sanity. Being an entrepreneur is isolating and tough and grueling at points so don’t throw yourself into a pit of angry, disgruntled, difficult and naggy clients if you can avoid it.

Jamie: There is another planner that I work with who’s very intentional and very hands-on and does great with follow-up emails. She is like, “I’m checking in to see how things are going.” I try to be, but I turn more into a wedding coach than a hands-on weekly check-in planner. I am not JLo. I will never be the JLo wedding planner. I’m not going with you to your address appointments. That’s not going to be me. I’m not going to plan those out for you. I’m not going to go to every vendor meeting. That’s not how my packages work.

In my initial client intake, if I’m getting that vibe from someone, I’m going to send them to that other planner. They’re going to end up being pissed at me because they have expectations that I choose to not meet. I choose to not operate my business that way. If that’s what they’re looking for, they’re going to be sorely disappointed. I layout those expectations clearly, “It sounds like this is what you’re looking for and I want to be clear as to what I’m offering,” or I pass them off and make sure that they’re getting what I need and I’m not being required to be a different kind of planner than I actually am.

Heather: Clear expectations are important. This thing I harp on with the couples in my course in the club. I tell them, “Be clear on your expectations or what you’re wanting from the vendor. Be clear with yourself on your expectations of the wedding and are you in the realm of reality with what your budget is?” In those two ways, you’ve got to check in on those expectations and keep your expectations in check, communicate them to your future spouse, to your friends, family and to your vendors and all these people. You’ve got to keep them all right on the same level of expectations. As a vendor, you’ve got to make sure that you’re going to meet the expectations because otherwise, you’re setting yourself for failure. Realistically, I like to undersell myself and exceed the expectations.

Jamie: It’s so nice when that happens. People are like, “I didn’t realize this is going to happen.”

 

Heather: This was spectacular and way more than you imagined. That is the optimal place to land is to undersell yourself and take a couple of things maybe you don’t mention on that list of deliverables. They show up and it’s magic and the people will love it. That’s how you get them to rave about you and spread the word for years and help your business stay very stable, sustainable and growing. I feel like everyone gets it that we’re here in a happy powwow of collaboration. Love each other and find ways to collaborate and be friends because ultimately, who doesn’t want more business friends?

Jamie: I want someone else to understand when I’m stressed out about how a timeline isn’t working out. I want someone else to relate. We started an event 30 minutes late and I’m still reeling about it. I’m like, “What could we have done differently?” It was Temecula traffic, but to have someone else who could go, “I know what you mean,” because my husband is not good at that.

Heather: As an entrepreneur, you’re isolated. Make your industry friends and be open. You can find opportunities, you can make win-wins. You can keep your mental health in check. All of this is important. Take care of yourselves and each other.

Jamie: That’s what collaboration does. It helps you and it relieves some of that pressure and it relieves some of the need to take all the business. Honestly, you end up saving time. You book the clients that you want. You build friends. You have someone that’s there in an emergency situation. I truly don’t see a downside to collaboration because you don’t want all the clients. Give them away to somebody else. You will end up making better money and then you can build a better reputation for yourself. I think that collaboration has no downside.

Heather: That’s it for now. Bye.

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